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Doubt in Angelus Bell in John W Schaum Piano Course E book

Posted: 02 Dec 2014, 08:36
by salex007
Hello everyone,
This is Alex from India. I had a piano teacher in my childhood for about two years. He gave a lot of importance to play classic and modern hymns and not as per the grade exam syllabus. I am pretty good in playing hymn.
Recently out of interest I started practicing with John W Schaum Piano Course E book . I have a doubt in the 'Angelus Bell' piece in C major (excerpt from Finlandia) in the John W Schaum Piano Course E Book. In the third line, in the bass clef C is made to C# . However in the subsequent bars it was not writtern back to C with a flat notation. When I play C# in the subsequent bars it sounds odd. Is it a typo or is the music right? I guess traditional piano books are seldom wrong however just out of curiosity I am tempted to ask. Could any one please clarify? Also could you please let me know the difficulty level of the book. Because I am rushing through it and thinking if I should start with next level book.

Alex Prabaharan

Re: Doubt in Angelus Bell in John W Schaum Piano Course E bo

Posted: 02 Dec 2014, 17:12
by Gill the Piano
Hello Alex. What you need to remember is that any accidental only lasts as far as the next barline. So in the next bar you're back to C natural. That should sound better!

Re: Doubt in Angelus Bell in John W Schaum Piano Course E bo

Posted: 03 Dec 2014, 11:50
by salex007
Thank you so much! :)


Re: Doubt in Angelus Bell in John W Schaum Piano Course E bo

Posted: 04 Dec 2014, 11:53
by Colin Nicholson
The only time an accidental is carried forward to the next bar is if the note is tied. :)
The usual cancellation sign is called a "natural" (not a flat) .... which restores the note.

The "ABRSM Guide to Music Theory" Book 1 is a good book to read for rudiments of music theory.

We cannot tell you if the book is at your level or not here on a forum.... a piano tutor will need to hear you play and assess your level/ grade, and hear you play other music aswell.

If you could scan the music and post it here (or my email) - I could give you an estimated grade (in terms of ABRSM standards).

If you are learning the music quickly & accurately/ correct rhythms/ good co-ordination etc, then try the next level.

Re: Doubt in Angelus Bell in John W Schaum Piano Course E bo

Posted: 07 Dec 2014, 16:25
by salex007
Hi Collin,

Thanks for the clarifiactions.Sorry I didnt see your reply. I knew about the natural notation. But when I posted that day, I guess there were lots of other things on my mind and it was a typo.In all the hymns I used to play during my college graduation days any sharps or flats are used to be restored using a natural sign immediately. Anyway i definitely has to refresh my music theory for the exams I am planning to take. Thank you so much!

Regarding the difficulty level, I thought of taking Trinity College London's Grade-3 Exam . So I thought of using a piano tutor book to warm up before practicing the examination syllabus pieces. I chose John W. Schaum piano course E book.Generally I am finishing the pieces(6 pieces so far) in abt 2-3 sittings of 30-45 mins practice.So I wondered if I should start practicing with F book in the John W Schaum series. Anyway here is the snapshot of the Angelus Bells excerpt piece I am talking about. (I played it with articulations in a single practice session perhaps because it was in Largo. I am not saying I played it perfectly but I would say it sounded as close as it sounds in you tube played by others).


Awaiting for your suggestions,

Note: I could not send the snapshot to your email.I will delete it after you checked the score. I dont want to violate copywright issues or the forum's terms and conditions.

Re: Doubt in Angelus Bell in John W Schaum Piano Course E bo

Posted: 09 Dec 2014, 13:45
by Colin Nicholson
Hi Alex
I myself do not use the Schaum books for teaching, unless a student wishes to purchase their own - so I do not know the difference between the E and F books in terms of grades. The piece you downloaded is ok for general learning (apart from the notes being very small & blurred).... I think this piece is too repetitive and 'linear' in chords to be a suitable exam piece.... and many pieces in tutor books are edited..... just an opinion.

Also, although I have a good comprehensive knowledge of piano classical music (up to Diploma), I do not use the Trinity College syllabus - sorry. I use the Associated Board of the Royal Schools of Music (ABRSM) - of which I have been registered with them for about 30 years. Teachers tend to use their own 'Board' & syllabus they were grown up with and perhaps rubs off on their pupils. If you intend to learn "Grade 3" (whatever Board you choose) - it is common sense to buy the listed pieces from this year, or previous years. Also there is sight reading & scales/ arpeggios for the grade. For grade 3 ABRSM.... as a guide, you would need to be learning music up to and including three sharps and flats (and their relative minors) .... such as B flat/ E flat major.... and G / C minor. The exercises and sight reading also 'reflect' on the key signatures for that grade, and may include voice parts in both hands.

Although the general skills required for each exam will be similar to each Board per grade, their marking system/ pass mark requirements and merit/ distinction boundaries are a lot different.... and can get complicated. So as I am 'born and bred' ABRSM.... I know their syllabus/ marking system etc backwards! :D

A colleague of mine has 2 boys.... they learn from the London Board .... and sometimes I hear their playing. They also have to do a short viva voce as part of the exam.... so each Board has subtle changes in its syllabus. You may be advised to seek as music teacher who 'deals' with Trinity exams.... however, many students switch to ABRSM.

Re the theory.... "Music Theory in Practise" by ABRSM (Grades 1-8) are good exercise books - each grade purchased separately (and provide past exam papers/ model answers), and you can also purchase the "Guide to Music Theory" Book 1 - Grades 1-5, which is a text book for reading up on the theory.... the exercise books then relate to a specific chapter in the guide book for additional help.... such as example.... "Cancellation of accidentals" (See Guide to Music Theory BK1/ page X chapter Y) .... which is covered in Grade 1 theory.

The general 'tone' of your message suggests you may need to start with an earlier grade?.... perhaps Grade 2?
Accidentals / cancellation of .... etc.... is a basic music requirement, taught at Grade 0 - 1 standard.
However, no one here can assess your grade without you attending a professional lesson or two so your performance skills/ sight reading/ scales/ aural tests/ theory of music can be fully assessed over a few lessons.

If the Schaum books do not denote an approximate grade span (e.g. Grade 1 - 2) for their pieces in the contents list, then I suggest you switch to ABRSM for now - starting with "More Romantic Pieces" Book 2 or 3.... or even some Grade 2 or 3 piano exam pieces (2013 - 2014). Also buy the Grade 2 or 3 "Specimen Sight Tests" and "Scales and arpeggios" for the grade - all by ABRSM.

Grade 3 sight reading is a killer by the way! :oops:

Hope that helps....

Re: Doubt in Angelus Bell in John W Schaum Piano Course E bo

Posted: 09 Dec 2014, 17:04
by salex007
Hi all,

If you're familiar with J.W.Schaum books please give your suggestions/feedback.Because there was a gap of ten years since I last played any serious music I thought I will start with an intresting book..

To Mr.Collins :
I would seriously think about staring with ABRSM board as I have not yet started any exam preparation.There are few audience here for classical music. Here in the place I live there is nothing like recitals or small music festival / local gatherings where you can play the classical music.So, exams will be my inspiration!Bless me! :piano;


Re: Doubt in Angelus Bell in John W Schaum Piano Course E book

Posted: 13 Nov 2017, 09:50
by Tiffansy
Thank you so much!