what do you think about Fazioli?

[yamaha2006]

Hi,

I just want to know more about this new brand?

Is it the best piano in the world and why?

Thanks.

[Gill the Piano]

Matter of opinion; some say they're the greatest piano ever, and others that it's over-engineered Italian histrionics! Having seen/heard/tuned the reaction of one which was subject to a sudden overnight drop in temperature, I'd be inclined to the latter...but that could be sour grapes! Go and try one, and see what you think. It's a bit like asking what the greatest car ever made was; you'll not get two answers the same.

[PianoGuy]

I'd tend to agree with Gill.

Beautifully built to look like they're wearing a sharp Italian suit by a charming man who never wears anything else, they are a triumph of design and technology, but every one I've tuned has been ridiculously false in the top treble and not particularly stable. Also very expensive. One for the Ferrari owner who values image and exclusivity above ultimate usability and enjoys talking about it down the pub.

Balance this with the fact that they do sound excellent and can be set up to play faultlessly, and the falseness and instability is the tuner's problem not the pianist's! Y'see, I kinda want to love these pianos, but they're such a pain to keep in tune that their fine attributes are lost on me. They're all owned by people who want the best out of them and thus demand constant attention. Just like the Ferrari. I don't mind taking the money, but I'd prefer a good S&S B or D any day of the week. They're less capricious and allow me to spend time on my other clients!

PG

[yamaha2006]

Ok Thanks.
A dealer in France does not want to sell Fazioli since they are a little capricious...and thinks that it's only good to see...
This dealer is the leader here in Piano renting to Concert halls and shows.

Why do you think Fazioli does not want to make Uprights...? Every manufacture does (even Boserdorfer or S&S)

[andyaeola]

Ressurecting an old thread...I was in Jaques Samuel, London, last week and tried their rather stunning range of pianos, including Grotrian, Ibach and Fazioli.

My question is about the Fazioli. Most of the piano sounds wonderful to me, except for the top two octaves. This is possibly because of the purity of tone it produces, which gives the high notes an intensely crystal clear ring. There were five or more Fazioli in Jaques Samuel, some were nicer than others, that's my personal taste.

Question: What do techs mean when they say the top octaves are false?
Pianoguy is not the only tech to have said this, and the other described old bechsteins as having the same falseness.

Regards

Andy

[PianoGuy]

Question: What do techs mean when they say the top octaves are false?
Pianoguy is not the only tech to have said this, and the other described old bechsteins as having the same falseness.

He's not wrong. Bechsteins are as bad if not worse than Fazioli for string falseness. It is the phenomenon of a single string producing a beat frequency when sounding on its own. It happens because the string is vibrating in the X-Y plane at a different speed to the A-B plane when viewed from one end along its length. The beat is produced by the interference of the different frequencies, and design of agraffes, capo-bars and the angle that the string describes through these devices cause the problem. Yamaha get it right all the time so it beats me why these prestigious makers constantly balls it up.

Given that tuners get unisons in tune by eliminating beats between strings, and that it's sometimes more than one string in the trichord (top notes have three strings remember!) that exhibits falseness, it can be a wearing task to disguise it.

[Barrie Heaton]

Question: What do techs mean when they say the top octaves are false?
Pianoguy is not the only tech to have said this, and the other described old bechsteins as having the same falseness.

Regards

Andy

The simplest way to explain it is if you take a single string in the top treble and pluck it you should get a pure note However, with a false note you hear a fazing sound as if two stings are being plucked and one string just out of tune with the other

All pianos have some false notes the older they get the more they get false

What causes false notes:

Poor scaling
Poor string termination (the bridges)
Bad stings
Rusty strings
Over stretched strings
To little down baring

Now on good makes you can tune in all 3 strings in and the false note disappears to a point. However, this can make some pianos unstable as you are pulling the note and taking it out more than you would like - so it take longer to tune so tuners hate false notes

False notes are not just in the treble some Yamaha pianos had very false bass notes but they are improving a lot

Bechsteins if rescaled and the agraphs are reamed out have quite a true treble but then they don’t sound like a Bechstein




Barrie,

[andyaeola]

Thanks for the replies. I got Larry Fines book off the shelf this afternoon and found this:
'The accuracy of bridge notching is extremely important. Inaccurate notching can result in wild strings (which produce permanently out-of-tune sounds known as false beats), buzzing sounds, and tinny tone.'

I suppose all pianos have the odd fault or two.

Regards

Andy