which castors for bechstein grand VA

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manuscript
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which castors for bechstein grand VA

Post by manuscript » 27 Jul 2013, 07:55

Hi everyone

I need to put new castors on a bechstein grand model VA. I have narrowed it down to these two:

http://www.fletcher-newman.co.uk/frameset.html

http://www.fletcher-newman.co.uk/frameset.html

Which ones do you think would be most appropriate? The piano will sit on castor cups and will not need to move when in position

Thanks

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Colin Nicholson
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Re: which castors for bechstein grand VA

Post by Colin Nicholson » 27 Jul 2013, 17:00

Not come across a VA Bechstein grand. [See history section for possible model letters]

Your F&N links have not taken us directly to the castors page [they never do] - but the home page instead.

Firstly - there is no set book/ instruction manual/ parts catalogue etc.... specifically labelled for certain grands - unless you contact Bechstein direct - and then again - if your piano is pre 19?? - who knows. Dont bother sending any further links just yet.

OK.... is the piano on its side [legs removed] - or is is fully assembled?

You may need to contact a piano technician - and one who owns a Grand raising jack - if the piano is assembled. There are about 6 different kinds of standard castor - so we need alot more info from you.

1. Any existing castor plate [X4] screw holes or pummell slot hole??
2. What shape are the legs - octagonal/ square tapered/ elephant feet/ dual gate?

We need to see pictures of the BOTTOM of any foot - not just a general photo side on. Also - any existing holes drilled will help us.

Grand castors vary according to the following....

Height -- 55mm - 127mm
Plate size/ wheel diameter - 38mm - 135mm
Pummell socket fitting -- around 11-13mm diameter [inside plate screws]

and.... need to know if you require 'steam roller' castors/ twin wheel/ how many legs? [3 or 6?] .... and depending on the LENGTH and WEIGHT of the piano - castors should be fitted by a pro technician - unless you have good DIY skills?

Don't forget - some pre 1900 grands didnt have castors - or some were set deep into the feet - bit like looking at a dalek!

If you are non-trade -- F&N may not serve you - so you may need to contact a specialist who has a grand raising jack.
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Re: which castors for bechstein grand VA

Post by Barrie Heaton » 27 Jul 2013, 18:17

Go back to F&N and find your castors from this link
http://www.fletcher-newman.co.uk/catalogue/index.html
Then post the link back on here

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Re: which castors for bechstein grand VA

Post by manuscript » 28 Jul 2013, 09:13

Hi again Colin

I have tried to post pics from my phone but it didn't work - I will try again from laptop

The piano is on a shoe. Legs and other removable parts are off. The legs have no holes drilled in the bottom at all. It was previously on an a-frame - do people chop off castors to do this?

I quite like the wide steam roller castors, and the narrow ones. I haven't seen any pianos with the steam roller ones and am a bit worried they will look OTT. The piano is 6ft7.

It has three square tapered legs. I have got someone who can supply and fit the castors. I just need to choose. The two choices within my budget-ish are both 75mm high and the pummel bit has a diameter of 20mm. It will sit on castor cups too

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Re: which castors for bechstein grand VA

Post by Colin Nicholson » 28 Jul 2013, 11:23

I'm surprised there are no holes there.
Do you still have the A frame ?
The only thing I can think is that part of the leg has been removed to fit it into each apex. .... but without pics I dont know.
I assume your 2 choices of castor will fit the legs - so without seeing both your choices I cant comment. Also check for holes at the sides? The old castors may have been the "square bucket" type. G727 [if you tell us the code for each - we know what you are referring to!!] ////.... these might be suitable >>

http://www.fletcher-newman.co.uk/catalo ... /g727.html

If previously fitted with an A Frame - make sure you check the wooden threads/dowels/ cleats etc for cracks.... quite common for old grand legs to collapse & crack in places.

It seems more like a Model B

Good luck with your castors.... I think a standard brass castor or square bucket type [see link] would be fine - the steam roller ones are more popular on concert/ modern grands.

If you send us the F&N pics - make sure you COPY the address then paste it into your forum page.... like above.
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Re: which castors for bechstein grand VA

Post by manuscript » 28 Jul 2013, 19:18

http://www.fletcher-newman.co.uk/catalo ... g726a.html I thought I had pasted this before but it appears to have worked properly now!

I think I will get these ones. I had considered the square cup ones but the legs would have to be cut down to fit. There are no holes at all in the legs and I don't have the frame. The piano was bought in an auction but the a frame was not part of the sale.

Apparently the model V is the predecessor of the model B and is one inch shorter!

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Re: which castors for bechstein grand VA

Post by Johnkie » 28 Jul 2013, 22:23

Unless there is already a large centre hole in the base of the legs I would use caution if considering fitting the G726As. I seem to remember the tapered legs on Bechstein grands generally have the G727 square cup type. I don't suppose it matters much if you do not intend moving it about, but if you do .... there would be a risk of the wood splitting seeing as the legs narrow quite an amount, in which case drilling a large hole will severely weaken it.

When original legs were the round wooden screw thread type, workshops often squared them off and tapered them to look more modern, but certainly the model B grands that had double legs with stretcher bars, were always fitted with square cup castors.
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Re: which castors for bechstein grand VA

Post by Colin Nicholson » 29 Jul 2013, 00:41

manuscript wrote:I quite like the wide steam roller castors, and the narrow ones.
Don't forget - this is not like shopping in Halfrauds for your bespoke wheels & trims for your car...... the castors must fit correctly for the design of legs you have - so not necessarily what you like the look of.
You also must take into consideration the height of the castors - if not high enough [or fitted incorrectly/ piano too low down] - you might not get the pedal lyre on. There is usually only a small gap between the floor & bottom of the lyre pedal box.

On average - most keyboard heights are about 30 inches from the floor. >>
grand.JPG
Standard square tapered legs usually come in 2 designs - a = square toe [for square cup castors.... and b = moulded toe [most castors with pummell sockets are ok]

If you decide to fit the pummell type & plate - the plate may need to be recessed into the leg - so you must order the correct plate size - too large - and the legs may crack.
The diagram below shows the 2 types >> [not Bechstein] ....
legs.JPG
legs.JPG (27.16 KiB) Viewed 4558 times
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Re: which castors for bechstein grand VA

Post by vernon » 29 Jul 2013, 18:47

we need to see a pic of the end of the leg.
An "A" frame sounds like a later addition for use in a hall or club.. If square cupped castors were removed prior to constructing the frame it's likely the " stubs" were sawn off, thinking that never in a million years would anyone want to fit ordinary castors in the future!
If so, you may be able to fit Homa castors. if the base is large enough.
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Re: which castors for bechstein grand VA

Post by Colin Nicholson » 30 Jul 2013, 00:22

manuscript wrote: I have got someone who can supply and fit the castors. I just need to choose.
???

I think its fair to say that we've heard it all! .... not only is Vernon spot on - but without putting anyone's name or methods into jeopardy - not only do do we need to see DETAILED pics of a leg - but more importantly - an "engineer's drawing" of the dimensions of ALL four square ends [including the depth of the moulding].... so I think without 'beating about the bush' - unless we see solid evidence as a picture - the following & remaining comments are for "general piano advice" only - and should not be taken at face-value until a qualified technician has addressed the issue properly -- then by all means - get back to us. My reasons are....

I don't think its a question any more of what you can pick & choose - if your 'supplier' can get them & fit them.... why do you have to choose them? .... doesn't make sense.

If it was me doing the job - simple - look at legs/ measure them / work out the height/ order correct castors .... if a pummell fitting - put legs in a lathe or pillar drill - and fit.

Why would your 'someone' leave you to choose castors - on the off-chance they were the wrong ones??
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Re: which castors for bechstein grand VA

Post by D.J.Smith » 05 Aug 2013, 14:19

manuscript. You ask which would be appropriate. A Bechstein Va would have had turned octagonal legs originally, so put on whatever fits and takes your fancy.

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