How DOES one learn the piano?

Questions on learning to play the piano, and piano music.

Moderators: Feg, Gill the Piano

Post Reply
User avatar
dave brum
Executive Poster
Executive Poster
Posts: 2614
Joined: 16 Oct 2013, 17:23
Location: Birmingham, England

How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by dave brum » 17 Oct 2013, 21:41

(original comment deleted)
Last edited by dave brum on 17 Nov 2013, 08:39, edited 1 time in total.
The world's unluckiest piano learner, quite possibly.

User avatar
Colin Nicholson
Executive Poster
Executive Poster
Posts: 1829
Joined: 04 Jul 2010, 19:15
Location: Morpeth, Northumberland
Contact:

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by Colin Nicholson » 18 Oct 2013, 08:52

These are some of my personal views & experiences in teaching adults in general.... and no way does it imply you, or anyone else

Any decent professional musician/ teacher/ mentor should always "speak their mind" and be honest. They may have said things for a reason. I sometimes tell adult learners that I have just heard UTTER CRAP! - yes, I even use those words. They can leave if they want, but then I play it as it should sound.... and they eventually agree with me.

I have also had some very unusual experiences with "adult tuition" - and I could write a book about certain idiomatic behaviour/ niuances/ ticks. Here are some examples of common 'adult tuition' anecdotes - and this is "general" behaviour/ real senarios...... I'll explain some of them along the way....

1. Very keen to start learning/ book extra or extended lessons/ good payers
2. Starter lessons/ basic counting & rhythms ok..... THEN....
3. Learn their music TOO FAST
4. Regular mistakes heard each week/ many wrong notes/ incorrect fingers
5. Over-ruling a decision/ argumentative
Example 1: (Me) "Oh, I'd like you to learn this piece of music X.... this will help to develop XYZ skills/ technique in your playing". (Adult learner): "No thank you, I'll just stick to what I've got"

Example 2: (Me): "Very nice playing, but the rhythm/notes etc need some care in bar X" (Learner): "I didn't think I made any mistakes there"

So.... I now have to CONVINCE them that some mistakes were made. With them saying that in the first place.... I sometimes think SOD IT.... why should I bother!.... let them get on with it.

6. Lessons becoming dysfunctional/ unnecessary interruptions.
Example: (Me): "I'd like to work on your..... [Learner: 'yeh yeh yeh OK (interrupting the moment I speak)] .....dotted rhythm here, and get it more flowing". (I show them an exercise) - [Learner] - plays it differently/ their own way.

7. Informing me that "I haven't practised this week by the way" .... the minute they step through the door.

8. Rhythms/ notes etc heard differently each week/ 'pear shaped' rhythms/ lacking co-ordination (despite being shown several times playing the music slowly).


These are just a smidgen of situations.
Its not the money/ cash.... I would rather they cancelled that lesson and I even go unpaid - rather than being put through TORTURE listening to the same old mistakes for SIX WEEKS running!!

As from last year, I now don't put up with it.... why should I?

Some adults I teach are very good, the complete opposite - but regrettably, those who choose to ignore their teacher's instructions - the lessons then become "unteachable".
They occasional form a sort of "rut" in their playing, and its difficult for them to get out of bad habits. If an adult doesn't practise at all - I just treat them like a kid. Those who don't practise PROPERLY think that I'm at their disposal just because they have paid for the lesson.... not so!

I have the skills...... dont need the cash..... adults now need to think outside the box before they book tuition - if the lessons become too "one sided" .... I just give them a friendly phone call/ email. We are also not put on this planet to deal with various "personal problems" - we want to help as much as possible - but would prefer to just do our job - and that's teach piano. Learners are encouraged to 'interact' - but when things awkward/ embarrassing/ dysfunctional/ "bloody minded" .... see ya later!!
AA Piano Tuners UK

Colin Nicholson Dip. Mus. CMIT CLCM PTLLS
Piano tuning & repairs. Full UK restoration service
http://www.aatuners.com
Tuition ~ Accompaniment ~ Weddings
http://www.pianotime1964.com
Member of The Guild of Master Craftsmen

User avatar
dave brum
Executive Poster
Executive Poster
Posts: 2614
Joined: 16 Oct 2013, 17:23
Location: Birmingham, England

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by dave brum » 18 Oct 2013, 11:44

(original comment deleted)
Last edited by dave brum on 17 Nov 2013, 08:40, edited 1 time in total.
The world's unluckiest piano learner, quite possibly.

User avatar
Colin Nicholson
Executive Poster
Executive Poster
Posts: 1829
Joined: 04 Jul 2010, 19:15
Location: Morpeth, Northumberland
Contact:

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by Colin Nicholson » 18 Oct 2013, 13:18

'Once bitten....' springs to mind.
I actually nearly sacked an adult learner the other day.... but thought.... "no hang on, there could be another option". This person started with me in January - late 50's (ish), a busy worker etc.... and around June, she wanted to start Grade 1 ABRSM. I explained that I dont usually teach "exam status" lessons to adults who have a busy working life style.... too much hassle. She assured me she was desperate to learn.... and would do "whatever" to achieve Grade 1. Anyway.... we started fairly slowly .... no more than FOUR bars a week! ...... and around 2 months ago, the pieces were more or less learnt - but in a "pidgeon music" way.... rhythm extremely erratic - counting 1 beat for dotted minims/ cutting short other rhythms, and a general up & down tempo.

When I teach exam stuff.... its on a timescale - its best for the learner - so they don't learn the pieces for too long/ get bored/ other mistakes creeping in. Well.. when I heard the B piece the other day.... it was HORRENDOUS.... due to NO practise at all for various weeks. The 'paying customer' expected me to just turn up and listen to that heap of junk regardless.

I then informed this learner that I had decided on continuing her tuition under a "non exam" status (and also I am very busy at tea time). .... I was welcome to continue with her, but I felt that she had not grasped the requirements of the pieces. When I tested her on the grade 1 broken chords one day.... I heard a stumbling performance of the grade 2 requirements!! .... and all notes held down & sustained. Scales/ pieces also - many fingers held down during legato passages, and the music ruined by excessive overlaps of sound.. I informed her for her own good.

She then decided to cancel me and find another teacher!! (phew!)

Now then.... I start teaching a "business man" tomorrow from scratch.... very nice chap.... he can play the first three notes from "My Favourite things"! ...... however - I will be briefing him very carefully before he decides to start lessons properly. I will tell him that I may only be able to teach to a certain level for his ability, and for a limited period only..... this depends on practise time & progress. I will also say that I DONT teach most adults exams - unless they show good potential. I treat everyone with respect - but just like a driving instructor, they dont really want to hear ex problems/ predicaments/ need of councelling etc.... they are there JUST to do their job - like a piano teacher. Once the lessons become dysfunctional - I say "thank you very much for your custom; I hope that the lessons were a suitable guide for you to continue at home" .... and I leave it there. I tend not to get involved with their problems because generally speaking, their practise time at home is "miniscule" .... and like the B piece before - it got worse, worser and worserer !!

I am happy for any adult or child learner to throw questions at me.... query away.... BUT, when questions are somewhat not related to the music/ exercise, or if things become too deep - we are not trained to deal with certain special 'cases' .

Regardless of being paid or not - if I'm told that I'm wrong in a decision - that's fine, we can work it out and see who is right.... I might be wrong.... but when adults clearly ignore all supportive tests I show them - they could throw £100 at me per lesson, but it wont change my mind if I prefer not to teach them anymore.

Finally.... I once took on an adult learner (who was sacked by a previous piano teacher I am very good friends with).... and when I heard him play, I could see why. I explained that they were missing various basic 'elements' from their playing (at around grade 5 standard) - and that IF he wished for me to continue, I would need to go back a few grades, and sort out each problem one by one. Gradually, the learner realised how to practise properly for a start.... then we developed finger technique, a better legato, better pedalling (using specially designed exercises) - and so on.... at this point, the learner didn't actually know (nor me at times!) .... how their playing suddenly developed better, and after about 12 months, I managed to rid him of his old habits. It was hard work at times.... he nearly gave up, and of course this "adult thing" - I told him frequently.... "NO thats not right" - swept his hands off the keys, and slowly he persevered.... special cases like that cost over £30 a lesson.
AA Piano Tuners UK

Colin Nicholson Dip. Mus. CMIT CLCM PTLLS
Piano tuning & repairs. Full UK restoration service
http://www.aatuners.com
Tuition ~ Accompaniment ~ Weddings
http://www.pianotime1964.com
Member of The Guild of Master Craftsmen

User avatar
dave brum
Executive Poster
Executive Poster
Posts: 2614
Joined: 16 Oct 2013, 17:23
Location: Birmingham, England

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by dave brum » 18 Oct 2013, 13:50

(original comment deleted)
Last edited by dave brum on 17 Nov 2013, 08:40, edited 1 time in total.
The world's unluckiest piano learner, quite possibly.

Gill the Piano
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 4114
Joined: 25 Oct 2003, 19:39
Location: Thames Valley

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by Gill the Piano » 18 Oct 2013, 15:41

If you are really truly determined, then you have to rid yourself of negativity and bloody well MAKE yourself do it. It's like losing weight or going to a gym or learning Welsh...if the overwhelming feeling is one of negativity, then nothing will be achieved. So get rid of negative thoughts...which leaves an empty room. And instead of dragging back all the negative stuff to fill the room again, import positive thoughts like 'I can do this and I'm going to, whatever XYZ may have said to me'. Piano teaching is 1 to 1 and therefore a very specific and intense sort of relationship, not like having a class teacher. Have you thought of going to a good jazz/band pianist and learning in a less rigid manner than ABRSM received syllabus stuff? I often put local people here onto a chap who thinks outside the box, uses a page from this book, a page from that one, writes out versions of songs they want to play...and several of them have responded very well to that type of learning method. Sometimes a musician who DOES can convey things in a way that makes them 'click' because they approach it differently. Just a thought! :)
I play for my own amazement... :piano;

User avatar
dave brum
Executive Poster
Executive Poster
Posts: 2614
Joined: 16 Oct 2013, 17:23
Location: Birmingham, England

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by dave brum » 18 Oct 2013, 17:42

(original comment deleted)
Last edited by dave brum on 17 Nov 2013, 09:00, edited 1 time in total.
The world's unluckiest piano learner, quite possibly.

User avatar
dave brum
Executive Poster
Executive Poster
Posts: 2614
Joined: 16 Oct 2013, 17:23
Location: Birmingham, England

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by dave brum » 18 Oct 2013, 18:53

(original comment deleted)
Last edited by dave brum on 17 Nov 2013, 09:00, edited 1 time in total.
The world's unluckiest piano learner, quite possibly.

Gill the Piano
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 4114
Joined: 25 Oct 2003, 19:39
Location: Thames Valley

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by Gill the Piano » 18 Oct 2013, 20:06

dave brum wrote:I've actually MADE myself lose five stones in weight...'Liberal' portions of cheesecakes with a good 4cm of filling in 'The Place To eat'??? Hey, that's worth looking forward to!
Can't have it all ways up, boy! :lol: And what the hell is 4cm??? Do you mean 2 inches??? :roll:
I play for my own amazement... :piano;

User avatar
dave brum
Executive Poster
Executive Poster
Posts: 2614
Joined: 16 Oct 2013, 17:23
Location: Birmingham, England

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by dave brum » 18 Oct 2013, 20:37

(original comment deleted)
Last edited by dave brum on 17 Nov 2013, 09:01, edited 1 time in total.
The world's unluckiest piano learner, quite possibly.

Gill the Piano
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 4114
Joined: 25 Oct 2003, 19:39
Location: Thames Valley

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by Gill the Piano » 19 Oct 2013, 16:07

You don't want to learn the piano, you want to PLAY it. And learn as a byproduct of playing. Contact your clever jazz man!
I play for my own amazement... :piano;

User avatar
dave brum
Executive Poster
Executive Poster
Posts: 2614
Joined: 16 Oct 2013, 17:23
Location: Birmingham, England

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by dave brum » 19 Oct 2013, 16:32

(original comment deleted)
Last edited by dave brum on 17 Nov 2013, 09:08, edited 1 time in total.
The world's unluckiest piano learner, quite possibly.

Gill the Piano
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 4114
Joined: 25 Oct 2003, 19:39
Location: Thames Valley

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by Gill the Piano » 20 Oct 2013, 14:28

dave brum wrote: I just love that name Alcyona Mick. Is her real name Maude Clatterbucket or something??
Highly probable. Or something not quite as glamorous as that...how do you SAY it, even??
I play for my own amazement... :piano;

User avatar
dave brum
Executive Poster
Executive Poster
Posts: 2614
Joined: 16 Oct 2013, 17:23
Location: Birmingham, England

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by dave brum » 20 Oct 2013, 17:09

(original comment deleted)
Last edited by dave brum on 17 Nov 2013, 09:09, edited 1 time in total.
The world's unluckiest piano learner, quite possibly.

Gill the Piano
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 4114
Joined: 25 Oct 2003, 19:39
Location: Thames Valley

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by Gill the Piano » 20 Oct 2013, 18:47

Sir Toby Belch is a Shakespearean character in Twelfth Night...at least he didn't call himself Bottom, I spose!
I play for my own amazement... :piano;

User avatar
dave brum
Executive Poster
Executive Poster
Posts: 2614
Joined: 16 Oct 2013, 17:23
Location: Birmingham, England

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by dave brum » 20 Oct 2013, 19:43

(original post deleted)
Last edited by dave brum on 17 Nov 2013, 08:53, edited 1 time in total.
The world's unluckiest piano learner, quite possibly.

User avatar
dave brum
Executive Poster
Executive Poster
Posts: 2614
Joined: 16 Oct 2013, 17:23
Location: Birmingham, England

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by dave brum » 20 Oct 2013, 20:46

(original post deleted)
Last edited by dave brum on 17 Nov 2013, 08:53, edited 1 time in total.
The world's unluckiest piano learner, quite possibly.

User avatar
Colin Nicholson
Executive Poster
Executive Poster
Posts: 1829
Joined: 04 Jul 2010, 19:15
Location: Morpeth, Northumberland
Contact:

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by Colin Nicholson » 20 Oct 2013, 22:25

Hi Dave,

Yes, with respect, when I read your ad, it is rather negative in places, and not "pitched" quite right (you did ask!). I like the "grade 2 distinction" bit - nice 1 .... but I don't think you need to mention your grade 3 (until you start lessons). Your reference to "three very bad teachers" .... mmm.... ok, they may have been bad with you, but I think its best not to reflect on the past too much & advertise it - afterall, any prospective teacher that may be thinking of approaching you, may not want the "tarred with the same brush" feeling, should you not like their teaching? Also, "one who doesn't bite" seems to 'have a go' at one (or more) of your previous teachers??
Looks rather "attacking" in places.

Just a suggestion.... but I think I would keep it very brief/ friendly/ approachable/ light humour etc, and don't go into so much detail. Rough suggestion......

"Hi, I am a middle aged chap in the X area of Birmingham, seeking a professional & friendly piano teacher/ mentor. I passed my Grade 2 ABRSM piano exam with distinction recently. I have had a break from the lessons due to various circumstances, and would welcome a local (or state distance willing to travel) and refreshing piano tutor to continue my studies with me. I am very flexible, friendly, hard working and willing to take on any challenge ahead of me. Please reply if you are interested".

How does that sound? ..... I feel its a taj more 'informal' / casual/ positive and has removed all the negatives/ making the teacher feel good about contacting you. Just a suggestion though - please amend/ edit if needed. :D

If I was to read your advert (in your area).... I think you would probably know by now if I would respond or not?.... :( and 3 weeks should already tell you something.

Good luck with that.

Colin
AA Piano Tuners UK

Colin Nicholson Dip. Mus. CMIT CLCM PTLLS
Piano tuning & repairs. Full UK restoration service
http://www.aatuners.com
Tuition ~ Accompaniment ~ Weddings
http://www.pianotime1964.com
Member of The Guild of Master Craftsmen

gizzy
Persistent Poster
Persistent Poster
Posts: 237
Joined: 30 Oct 2010, 14:28

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by gizzy » 21 Oct 2013, 00:23

Dave, why are you still telling people you failed grade 3? You were two marks shy of a distinction

User avatar
dave brum
Executive Poster
Executive Poster
Posts: 2614
Joined: 16 Oct 2013, 17:23
Location: Birmingham, England

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by dave brum » 21 Oct 2013, 06:54

(original post deleted)
Last edited by dave brum on 17 Nov 2013, 08:52, edited 2 times in total.
The world's unluckiest piano learner, quite possibly.

User avatar
dave brum
Executive Poster
Executive Poster
Posts: 2614
Joined: 16 Oct 2013, 17:23
Location: Birmingham, England

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by dave brum » 21 Oct 2013, 07:47

(original post deleted)
Last edited by dave brum on 17 Nov 2013, 08:51, edited 2 times in total.
The world's unluckiest piano learner, quite possibly.

gizzy
Persistent Poster
Persistent Poster
Posts: 237
Joined: 30 Oct 2010, 14:28

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by gizzy » 21 Oct 2013, 10:00

dave brum wrote: Now, I'd call that a failure.....
On the contrary - you did read your mark sheet, yes? That tells you a bit more than just "merit", it tells you "stuffed up your scales - OK, only passed them by two marks - apart from which this would be saying Distinction Dave"

What would you think of a musician who was able to turn out a convincing performance in spite of going through hell inside? Dave, in spite of all you were going through, YOU PERFORMED. You performed well enough to get merit marks in two pieces and a distinction mark in the third. Well enough to drop only two marks in aural, and - bloomin' 'eck, Dave, to get 18/21 for sheight-reading!!! If I have a pupil get 18/21 for s/r I'm over the moon, it's so rare. So you got your almost-distinction not because of what you were feeling, but in spite of it, which must mean you were genuinely well grounded in the material, and genuinely ABLE to play at grade 3 level. A great performer doesn't just come up with the goods when they're feeling good, they can do it even when they're feeling lousy. You performed.

If exams make you feel that bad, nobody says you ever have to take another one, but you could still have started learning grade 4 pieces as you did like some of them - just for your own pleasure. Yes, it'll be a long haul up again from your having given up for a while, but you showed then that you had the ability as a pianist. Maybe not the temperament for exams under adverse conditions, but then exams are not the one and only mark of a good player. You proved that you could play, on that day, and you can do it again, just not to one Beckmesser behind closed doors.

*&$%* if there was every anyone to whom the epithet "your own worst enemy" applied, it's you. Pick yerself up, dust yerself down, start all over again, or rather get some grade 2-ish level material, there's heaps of it out there, and take yourself through it at your own rate (you can read music) since you're not now preparing to let yourself be judged by anyone else. Play wrong notes. We all do. I still do. Just explore books for things you decide you like the sound and feel of, and when you're looking for a teacher, say "I passed grade 3 but have got a bit rusty; currently working on XYZ but just for fun"

I'd call it a success, doubly so because of what was going on inside while you were doing all that outside.

Take care, all the best
Gizzy

User avatar
dave brum
Executive Poster
Executive Poster
Posts: 2614
Joined: 16 Oct 2013, 17:23
Location: Birmingham, England

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by dave brum » 21 Oct 2013, 16:08

(original post deleted)
Last edited by dave brum on 17 Nov 2013, 08:50, edited 4 times in total.
The world's unluckiest piano learner, quite possibly.

User avatar
dave brum
Executive Poster
Executive Poster
Posts: 2614
Joined: 16 Oct 2013, 17:23
Location: Birmingham, England

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by dave brum » 21 Oct 2013, 20:31

(original post deleted)
Last edited by dave brum on 17 Nov 2013, 08:50, edited 1 time in total.
The world's unluckiest piano learner, quite possibly.

User avatar
dave brum
Executive Poster
Executive Poster
Posts: 2614
Joined: 16 Oct 2013, 17:23
Location: Birmingham, England

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by dave brum » 08 Nov 2013, 18:41

(original post deleted)
Last edited by dave brum on 17 Nov 2013, 08:49, edited 1 time in total.
The world's unluckiest piano learner, quite possibly.

User avatar
dave brum
Executive Poster
Executive Poster
Posts: 2614
Joined: 16 Oct 2013, 17:23
Location: Birmingham, England

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by dave brum » 09 Nov 2013, 16:54

(original post deleted)
Last edited by dave brum on 17 Nov 2013, 08:48, edited 1 time in total.
The world's unluckiest piano learner, quite possibly.

Gill the Piano
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 4114
Joined: 25 Oct 2003, 19:39
Location: Thames Valley

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by Gill the Piano » 10 Nov 2013, 19:48

Excellent. Soon have you faffing about at Fiona again... :piano;
I play for my own amazement... :piano;

User avatar
dave brum
Executive Poster
Executive Poster
Posts: 2614
Joined: 16 Oct 2013, 17:23
Location: Birmingham, England

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by dave brum » 10 Nov 2013, 21:03

(original post deleted)
Last edited by dave brum on 17 Nov 2013, 08:47, edited 1 time in total.
The world's unluckiest piano learner, quite possibly.

pianoladybirmingham
Junior Poster
Junior Poster
Posts: 10
Joined: 13 Nov 2013, 21:30

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by pianoladybirmingham » 13 Nov 2013, 21:43

i read the exact same posts recently from a couple of years ago.? .... why are you still festering dave? those poor teachers! best move on and do something else as I`m sure it cannot help you by repeating the same things over and ovr. I too had a terrible time learning but realised it was me being difficult to teach as put up barriers due to my health. thank god my teacher realised and works with me and not against me.
negativity breeds more so break free and stop b4 you go loopy!

User avatar
dave brum
Executive Poster
Executive Poster
Posts: 2614
Joined: 16 Oct 2013, 17:23
Location: Birmingham, England

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by dave brum » 14 Nov 2013, 18:55

(original post deleted)
Last edited by dave brum on 17 Nov 2013, 08:46, edited 1 time in total.
The world's unluckiest piano learner, quite possibly.

Gill the Piano
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 4114
Joined: 25 Oct 2003, 19:39
Location: Thames Valley

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by Gill the Piano » 15 Nov 2013, 18:41

Well here's hoping the lady in Wales can help you, chicken.
I play for my own amazement... :piano;

User avatar
dave brum
Executive Poster
Executive Poster
Posts: 2614
Joined: 16 Oct 2013, 17:23
Location: Birmingham, England

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by dave brum » 15 Nov 2013, 18:47

I think she will, Gill. I just have to learn to trust her and not keep thinking that I'm right and everyone else is wrong. And enjoy it as well.

:piano;
The world's unluckiest piano learner, quite possibly.

Gill the Piano
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 4114
Joined: 25 Oct 2003, 19:39
Location: Thames Valley

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by Gill the Piano » 15 Nov 2013, 21:31

Also, you must NOT think that you're wrong and everyone else is right! :lol:
I play for my own amazement... :piano;

User avatar
dave brum
Executive Poster
Executive Poster
Posts: 2614
Joined: 16 Oct 2013, 17:23
Location: Birmingham, England

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by dave brum » 15 Nov 2013, 22:55

Gill the Piano wrote:Also, you must NOT think that you're wrong and everyone else is right! :lol:
:!:
The world's unluckiest piano learner, quite possibly.

Gill the Piano
Moderator
Moderator
Posts: 4114
Joined: 25 Oct 2003, 19:39
Location: Thames Valley

Re: How DOES one learn the piano?

Post by Gill the Piano » 16 Nov 2013, 17:31

:mrgreen:
I play for my own amazement... :piano;

Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 5 guests